Eurodriiiift clip

[mnpctech]

Found this supercar vid montage..... crank up the sound :thumb:

Eurodriiiift clip (http://www.putfile.com/media.php?n=eurodriiift)

[Knipex]

WTF is an opel estate doing in there.....

Nice clip though.

[fillip]

WTF is an opel estate doing in there.....

Nice clip though.

lol. I thought it was a bloody Vauxhall but was looking at the badge going "wtf is it!"
Made a nice screaching sound as they threw it into the corners though, half expected the tires to shred.

[Knipex]

Opel, Vauxhall same car different badge.

[fivecheebs]

hehe ... i liked the exige that was slightly too hot!

Nice link bill

[fillip]

Opel, Vauxhall same car different badge.

That's my point, I didn't recognise it as an Opel badge, but recognised the shape of the car.

[mnpctech]

Whatever it is... Its my kinda family car :D

[Starbuck3733T]

my daughter says "why can't you do that in YOUR car?"

I say because it'll flip over and that'd be bad.

she says:" oh.

[Leeum]

my daughter says "why can't you do that in YOUR car?"

I say because it'll flip over and that'd be bad.

she says:" oh.

:lol: Ahh...kids eh? :-p

[walkitiki]

Does that Benz (second clip) always sound like an airplane?

[zittware]

my daughter says "why can't you do that in YOUR car?"

I say because it'll flip over and that'd be bad.

she says:" oh.

Sounds like you got a 2/3rd's majority vote to buy one of those and take it to the track.

What more does a man need? ^_^

[jaguarking11]

Does that Benz (second clip) always sound like an airplane?

Thats the sound of a supercharger (or compressor as benz calls them).

I like the aston martin. (have a thing about british cars), the rest of the cars were nice too but not my style. Good stuff tho.

[fillip]

I like the aston martin.

Amen to that

[Knipex]

I like the aston martin. (have a thing about british cars), .

Has hell frozen over ?????
Will the world end ???

Jaguarking11 and Knipex agree on something car related :eek:

:clap::clap:

[fillip]

Has hell frozen over ?????
Will the world end ???

Jaguarking11 and Knipex agree on something car related :eek:

:clap::clap:

lol. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/laugh.gif

[furious trout]

Has hell frozen over ?????
Will the world end ???

Jaguarking11 and Knipex agree on something car related :eek:

:clap::clap:

I can confirm the sighting of a pig flying past my house today...:h34r:

[fillip]

I can confirm the sighting of a pig flying past my house today...:h34r:

Ahhhh, but, was it an assisted flight or was the pig self-propelled?

Very important, you see it could've just been kids launching various farm yard animals past your house for the fun of it. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/nods.gif

[GodsUnicorn]

WTF is an opel estate doing in there.....


Spinning mostly.

[furious trout]

Ahhhh, but, was it an assisted flight or was the pig self-propelled?

Very important, you see it could've just been kids launching various farm yard animals past your house for the fun of it. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/nods.gif
Definitely self propelled. I saw the wings...:wiz:

[jaguarking11]

Ok ok ok
Settle down people. mY nic would imply I have a thing for jaguars. Always have, the sight of a forest green metalic jaguar gives me a tingling feeling. Always have had a very big thing for 1960's dtype jags. I love the v12 dtypes with their overwhelmingly long nose and springy ride. I like newer aston martins also. I dont particularly like minis as I would rather drive a vw bettle stripped down with a 2L motor, aircooled goodnes.

Point being is that I have a wide taste in cars, but I prefer large displacement cars over small ones. Comfort is a big thing as well as off the line aceleration. I like the feel of tourque over the feel of a high reving motor. Yes it sounds very contradictory but you will find the jags and new austins fit the bill.

Now move along, nothing to see here.

[mnpctech]

Sorely disppointed the new GT40 didn't make an appearance.

It went back to the shop to have it's alarm fixed :lol:

[fillip]

Sorely disppointed the new GT40 didn't make an appearance.

It went back to the shop to have it's alarm fixed :lol:

They only wanted cars that could turn corners you see http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/tongue.gif

http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/grin.gif

[Starbuck3733T]

:lol:

I'm a neutral party, but there are some days where HP and torque are what I'm craving.

[Da_Rude_Baboon]

Thats the sound of a supercharger (or compressor as benz calls them).


Ahhh i always assumed that kommpressor = Turbo. Learn something new every day. :thumb:

[fillip]

Ahhh i always assumed that kommpressor = Turbo. Learn something new every day. :thumb:

So what's the difference between a turbo and supercharger then? because I assumed the same as you DRB.

[fivecheebs]

Dont ya just love wikipedia :thumb:

Turbo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbo
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

Turbo is an acronym for TURbine BOosted. This means that it comprises a turbine to extract energy from an internal combustion engine and using this energy to boost the air input to the engine, thus increasing the volumetric efficiency i.e. giving more power.

Supercharger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supercharger
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.

For other meanings, see supercharger (disambiguation)

A supercharger (also known as a blower, a positive displacement pump or a centrifugal pumper) is a gas compressor used to pump air into the cylinders of an internal combustion engine. In gasoline engines this is the fuel/air mixture (the charge) when the fuel has been added. This increases the mass of oxygen and of fuel in the cylinder, thus improving the volumetric efficiency of the engine making it more powerful. It is similar in purpose to the closely related turbocharger, but with a clear difference. Whilst a turbocharger is powered by the mass-flow of exhaust gases driving a turbine, a supercharger is powered mechanically, by belt- or by chain-drive from the engine's crankshaft . A supercharger may absorb as much as a third of the total crankshaft power of the engine, but at the same time may increase total engine output by over 100 percent.

my emphasis

[fillip]

Ah, thanking you kindly. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/happy.gif

[walkitiki]

Ah, seeing the actual definition of a supercharger really makes the KOMPRESSOR on the back of the Benz make a lot more sense.

Many thanks Cheebs

[Da_Rude_Baboon]

They do the same job but a supercharger is powered off of the engine by a belt and turbo is powered by the exhaust gasses. Superchargers work at low revs as they are engine powered while a turbo normally needs higher revs so the exhaust gasses are at the right pressure to power it, which is known as turbo lag.

If i got that spectaculary wrong please correct me. :thumb:

:edit: Cheebs beat me to it! :-p :edit:

[walkitiki]

a turbo normally needs higher revs so the exhaust gasses are at the right pressure to power it, which is known as turbo lag.

So turbo lag would be the delay in the increase in power due to the amount of gases that have to build up for the turbo to be effective? I was recently talking to a 930 owner who said he replaced the stock turbo with a newer one, to combat the turbo lag...I had no idea what he was talking about.

[fivecheebs]

Pleasure fil .... :finger: DRB

I think the lag is how long it takes from the turbine to start spinning until the time that it actually becomes effective.

lol that might be what you just said ^_^

[fillip]

So turbo lag would be the delay in the increase in power due to the amount of gases that have to build up for the turbo to be effective? I was recently talking to a 930 owner who said he replaced the stock turbo with a newer one, to combat the turbo lag...I had no idea what he was talking about.

Turbo lag is also affected by the size of the turbo. Bigger = more lag generally, esp. with single turbos which provide higher output and greater low end torque (from what I gather) compared to twin turbo systems which are generally less powerful than a huge singles, but don't suffer from such bad lag. The first turbo in a twin turbo sequential setup will spool up first at low revs, then the second will come online higher up the rev' range.

[scopEDog]

So turbo lag would be the delay in the increase in power due to the amount of gases that have to build up for the turbo to be effective? I was recently talking to a 930 owner who said he replaced the stock turbo with a newer one, to combat the turbo lag...I had no idea what he was talking about.

Turbo lag is the time it takes for the turbo to spool. He might have gone to a smaller turbo with a quicker spool up (focused more on low end) than a bigger turbo with a slower spool up (focused more on high end).

I've been a few cars where the turbo "kicks in" at 2500rpm and others at 5000rpm. Really changes the way the car behaves.

[fivecheebs]

Not all turbos suffer with lag noticeably. The one in my car is excellent but it is fairly tame ^_^

[walkitiki]

Turbo lag is also affected by the size of the turbo. Bigger = more lag generally, esp. with single turbos which provide higher output and greater low end torque (from what I gather) compared to twin turbo systems which are generally less powerful than a huge singles, but don't suffer from such bad lag. The first turbo in a twin turbo sequential setup will spool up first at low revs, then the second will come online higher up the rev' range.


Turbo lag is the time it takes for the turbo to spool. He might have gone to a smaller turbo with a quicker spool up (focused more on low end) than a bigger turbo with a slower spool up (focused more on high end).

I've been a few cars where the turbo "kicks in" at 2500rpm and others at 5000rpm. Really changes the way the car behaves.

He went from the stock turbo on the 930 to a newer KKK K27 turbo, he said it gave him a huge boost in BHP, from 300 to 390 with some other upgrades (steel headers and exhaust). I'm gonna have to look into the size of the turbos, this is really fascinating, but I've had a hard time tracking down the specs of the orginial turbo on the 930.

By the way, I've never seen people being anymore helpful than you guys -_-

[fillip]

I've learnt a fair bit about turbo's by spending time on the UK supra forums (supra's are a bit of an obsession for me) so I s'pose any car enthusiast forum would prove useful in improving your knowledge. I do know that the lag with after market single's used to be pretty awful, but the newer stuff uses better bearings or something which helps improve the spool time of the turbo. Bear in mind that for the big turbos there will always be a noticeable lag as the pressure just can't build up quick enough to start spooling the turbo.
FWIW my first proper car when I move to Aus' is gonna be a supra which i'm modding to a single turbo street car. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/trampoline.gif

[scopEDog]

Oye! the kkk k27 is good for like 600hp, very robust. Very popular for porsche fans, i think there were a few running in that porsche club i attend every so often. If i remember correctly it was stock item on some older mercedes in europe (yup...us americans always get shafted when it comes to the good stuff).

[fillip]

(yup...us americans always get shafted when it comes to the good stuff).

Yeah right, that's exactly how most of us outside the U.S. feel http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/tongue.gif

[fivecheebs]

the grass is always greener .....

[Da_Rude_Baboon]

Two of my friends have turbo cars, an old escort RS turbo and a Imprezza turbo sport wagon. In the RS the turbo kicks in higher up the rev range with a very noticeable boost in speed. In the Imprezza the turbo kicks in quite low at 2500 rpm (iirc) and tbh it doesn't feel like theres a turbo there as its such a smooth transition of power. It just feels very quick.

[walkitiki]

I remember reading somewhere that the newest Porsche twin turbos use KKK turbos, but I don't remember the model or even if it was listed. Its good to know that Porsche used the same company then and now to manufacture turbos and I wouldn't put anything different from that on my Porsche.

Lots of times it seems people want to make their car so glitzsy, big rear wings (especially on the 993s, makes me want to throw up) without appreciating the beauty of the Porsche engineering. I don't like Gemballas, however I do find RUF to be acceptable, lately I've liked them more, but for the most part its hard to find an unmolested Porsche.

porscheRant.terminateRant()

[walkitiki]

In the Imprezza the turbo kicks in quite low at 2500 rpm (iirc) and tbh it doesn't feel like theres a turbo there as its such a smooth transition of power. It just feels very quick.

Same way in my Mom's A4, I'd always noticed that if you pressed it a little harder and got the RPMs up just a bit there was a big push, didn't realize that was the turbo kicking in,

Learning is fun!!

[fillip]

With some turbos there's a noticeable whine as they start to spool up too.

[fivecheebs]

Thats the wastegate isnt it that makes that whine?

I can hear it if i listen hard.... sounds nice B)

[walkitiki]

What makes that pssshhh sound as you change gears with a turbo?

(stupid question maybe??)

[fillip]

Thats the wastegate isnt it that makes that whine?

I can hear it if i listen hard.... sounds nice B)

No, the sound of a waste gate and spooling turbo is different. As is the blow off valve sound different once again. Lots of weird sounds eminating from turbo cars. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/grin.gif

A spooling turbo makes a sound reminiscent of a jet engine winding up, just no where near as noisy.

[fillip]

What makes that pssshhh sound as you change gears with a turbo?

BOV - blow off valve or dump valve. It's the excess pressure being dumped direct to the atmosphere.

[Da_Rude_Baboon]

The turbo spinning up makes a whistling, wooshy kind of sound. The dump valve makes a psst sound like opening a bottle of soda. The waste gate valve makes a strange sound which is hard to describe. If you watch the rallying the sound of the wastegate is very noticeable.

[fillip]

The turbo spinning up makes a whistling, wooshy kind of sound. The dump valve makes a psst sound like opening a bottle of soda. The waste gate valve makes a strange sound which is hard to describe. If you watch the rallying the sound of the wastegate is very noticeable.

Until this discussion I didn't actually realise that there was any sound coming from the wastegate. You do learn something everyday dont you! http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/grin.gif

[fivecheebs]

ahhhh ... the wastegate makes that kinda squeeky sound?

Its the spinning up i can hear then :thumb:

[fillip]

Is an atmospheric wastegate the same as a BOV? They seem to perform the same function regarding controlling boost pressure. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/shrug.gif

[Da_Rude_Baboon]

You nailed it cheebs! That exactly the noise i was meaning. :D

Fillip tbh i have no idea as the only reason i know any of this is by asking my friends 'what makes that noise?'

[furious trout]

Is an atmospheric wastegate the same as a BOV? They seem to perform the same function regarding controlling boost pressure. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/shrug.gif

I was under the impression they were the same thing fwiw...

[fillip]

I was under the impression they were the same thing fwiw...

Thought it may have been, just wanted to check. http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/thumb.gif

[furious trout]

And yet I'm now about to prove myself wrong

wastegate (http://www.streetracersonline.com/articles/turbo/wastegate.php)

blow off valve (http://www.streetracersonline.com/articles/turbo/bov.php)

Must remember to look up the answer before posting in future :duh:

[fillip]

Right, so a wastegate prevents too much exhaust gas entering the turbo whereas a BOV releases the pressure inside the turbo when not on full boost, e.g. when shifting etc.

[Alan Partridge] Ahhhaaaaaa! [/AP]

[jaguarking11]

Ok yes a supercharger uses power to make power but you need lower presures to make monster power so you can have weird compression ratios.

A turbo uses wasted power to make power.

Now on the turbo lag department. Its all on the way the turbo is deployed. THey have geometric turbos now a days that keep a good spool speed constantly so it provides very constant power by pushing almost the same amount of air all the time but the only thing saving it from blowing your heads off is recycling wastegauge thats constantly on back into itself. A geometric turbo works kind of like a camera lense.

And scope they have been geting over 1000hp out of grand national buicks for the last 16 years with tt setups out of a 3.8L v6. You can get garret turbos that are both oil cooled and lubricated by the engine and the berings are calculated to last for years withought worrying. Turbos are truck tech that made it way to cars.

Since we are on the subject of forced induction. I can say an intercooler works from this principle. It takes air in and cools it down so you can get cooler air with more oxygen in it so the combustion is more efficient. They refer to it as free power but I supose you have to figure in weight. By free I mean it does not take power to make power and you dont need to add a cooler fan since most intercoolers are bolted to the bottom of a car or infront of the radiator.

btw this is just scratching the tip of the cieberg when it comes to engines.

[Frodo]

actually, superchargers dont use that much power to make the amount of power they do

look at classic cars, they had vicous fans that ran of the crank, so these would be taking power, so the best thing to do (my example will be a car i will have/alreayd got when i turn 21) is an mg midget 1275 mk3, british cars all the way

right, so you could turbo a midget easily, get an old mg metro turbo (yoink the turbo) but youve got to much around with all the manifold and that crapola, or you can get a decent supercharger, that has some serious powa, and doesnt have the downsides of a turbo, no lag, no stupid sounds that make your car like a hairdryer blowing up, and loadsa power AND torque through out the entire rev range.

now, turbo's are my fancy, i love superchargers, but im personally going for a 2 stage turbo setup (because there is enough space to) which will rely on 2 big turbo's (unlike normal 2 stage turbo setups, using 2 smaller ones instead of a signle big turbo) this will prevent lag, the first turbo will spool up at around 1.5k (the car redlines at 6k so meh) and the 2nd turbo will spool up at about 3-4k which will give an awesome kick, but another advantage of turbo's... adjustable boost :D yeah baby, always loved them for this!

in the car you can set up 2 (or 1 dependant on how many turbo's your using) in car turbo boost controllers, so you can have the first turbo at say 8 psi and 2nd at say 12psi, or for racing or street racing 12psi first and 18psi on the 2nd, which would give some SERIOUS power.

intercoolers dont cool normal air, they cool the air thats coming from the turbo exhaust (as it is warmer... because its been through the engine!) and cools it, making it more dense and therefore more air per cm, meaning cleaner/faster/more effieceint combustion... meaning MORE POWAHHHHH

i know alot about car's, im 16, but have grown up with them, and have been working on them for years.

quick tip for anyone with a car using a vicous fan (a fan attached to a crank) goto a local scrapyard, look through mercs, find an electric fan on one, remove the vicous and put the electric fan on your rad, can increase power by about 5bhp and gives more responsive throttle!

[jaguarking11]

actually, superchargers dont use that much power to make the amount of power they do

look at classic cars, they had vicous fans that ran of the crank, so these would be taking power, so the best thing to do (my example will be a car i will have/alreayd got when i turn 21) is an mg midget 1275 mk3, british cars all the way

right, so you could turbo a midget easily, get an old mg metro turbo (yoink the turbo) but youve got to much around with all the manifold and that crapola, or you can get a decent supercharger, that has some serious powa, and doesnt have the downsides of a turbo, no lag, no stupid sounds that make your car like a hairdryer blowing up, and loadsa power AND torque through out the entire rev range.

now, turbo's are my fancy, i love superchargers, but im personally going for a 2 stage turbo setup (because there is enough space to) which will rely on 2 big turbo's (unlike normal 2 stage turbo setups, using 2 smaller ones instead of a signle big turbo) this will prevent lag, the first turbo will spool up at around 1.5k (the car redlines at 6k so meh) and the 2nd turbo will spool up at about 3-4k which will give an awesome kick, but another advantage of turbo's... adjustable boost :D yeah baby, always loved them for this!

in the car you can set up 2 (or 1 dependant on how many turbo's your using) in car turbo boost controllers, so you can have the first turbo at say 8 psi and 2nd at say 12psi, or for racing or street racing 12psi first and 18psi on the 2nd, which would give some SERIOUS power.

intercoolers dont cool normal air, they cool the air thats coming from the turbo exhaust (as it is warmer... because its been through the engine!) and cools it, making it more dense and therefore more air per cm, meaning cleaner/faster/more effieceint combustion... meaning MORE POWAHHHHH

i know alot about car's, im 16, but have grown up with them, and have been working on them for years.

quick tip for anyone with a car using a vicous fan (a fan attached to a crank) goto a local scrapyard, look through mercs, find an electric fan on one, remove the vicous and put the electric fan on your rad, can increase power by about 5bhp and gives more responsive throttle!

Firstly superchargers sometimes can take as mutch as 30% of engine power to make it. Top fuel dragsters have extremly large superchargers that need around 700hp and 1000LB of tourque to push as mutch as they do yet they make the motor produce in exess of 7000HP.

as for going for two stage turbos and having large ones kicking in at diferent rpm's. it takes more than that to do such a thing. Its not a simple bolt on. I wish you luck doing it. I would rather have a geometric turbo that pushes huge amounts of cfm and high presures at high rpm and mild cfm and presure at low rpm.

I dont think twin turbo setups are eficient in smaller motors. Lets contrast here. it takes lingenfelter 20psi max to produce 800hp out of their z06 vette and have it run 1.9sec 0-60. On the other hand a toyota supra with a 3L motor needs around 100kilos of boost to match the tourque output along the rpm line as the z06. Yes it produces over 1000hp out of the supra but the tourque line is all over the place. Now b4 you call me anti supra or anything I always had a thing about 1980's supras.

Ill be first to say that I dont know as mutch as others about motors but things are never as simple as they seem. There is alot of tweaking to do on a engine to run high pressures. You would be lucky to run 15psi out of your motor withought blowing the heads off. Not to mention your crank can fail and the list of problems can go on. Allot of people go as far as welding the heads on to prevent blowout and rip the bottom of the block off and rebuild it with truck spec suports and reworked crank to handle the pressures. AT the end of the day they have sucseeded in runing high pressures but esentialy created a throw away motor.

....goes off to drool over a d-type v12 pictures with no turbos or anything of the sort just its 6 webbers.

[fillip]

If you have a twin turbo setup you also need turbos of equal size too don't you, because otherwise you're either pushing too much pressure through into a smaller turbo that can't hack it or you're not puching enough through to the larger unit.
I'm intrigued to know how you're going to get a large turbo that spools at 1.5k because the best numbers I've seen for big turbo's are 2.5k and up (bear in mind the stuff I have seen is limited to U.S., UK and Aussie Supra forums so it's far from exhaustive and may well be well wide of the mark.)

As for the torque thing on tt supras, I couldn't agree more JK, as the standard tt setup with 3L. engine it's a great car but it's speed is all about high HP rather than big torque, something which is greatly helped by ditching the sequential TT's and going with a mid range > big single. The major caveat of which is that you're turning the car into a drag car rather than a street car the bigger the turbo you stick in there, something which is definately not suitable for many of the roads over here, so some of the best street Supra's in the UK are built around a mid range single setup with various other mods.

[jaguarking11]

If you have a twin turbo setup you also need turbos of equal size too don't you, because otherwise you're either pushing too much pressure through into a smaller turbo that can't hack it or you're not puching enough through to the larger unit.
I'm intrigued to know how you're going to get a large turbo that spools at 1.5k because the best numbers I've seen for big turbo's are 2.5k and up (bear in mind the stuff I have seen is limited to U.S., UK and Aussie Supra forums so it's far from exhaustive and may well be well wide of the mark.)

As for the torque thing on tt supras, I couldn't agree more JK, as the standard tt setup with 3L. engine it's a great car but it's speed is all about high HP rather than big torque, something which is greatly helped by ditching the sequential TT's and going with a mid range > big single. The major caveat of which is that you're turning the car into a drag car rather than a street car the bigger the turbo you stick in there, something which is definately not suitable for many of the roads over here, so some of the best street Supra's in the UK are built around a mid range single setup with various other mods.

Large turbos are beneficial in large motors more as the rpm of a large motor tends to be lower and twin setups tend to do better on larger motors as well. The smaller 3L motor on the supra would benefit more from a good cam setup concentrating the tourque to lower rpm and let the turbo kick in just before the tourque peak is reached so the shift would be seemless. Well theoreticaly anyway. As for twin setups you dont have to have equal turbos as far as I know as they have valves that open and close with higher revs. Kinda like switching gears but it switches turbos. TT setups are almost always considered to be paralel but with some good plumbing you can run two diferent sizes that take care of the whole rpm range.

Oh and your rite 1500rpm, spooling a large turbo is not done with a small motor. It could be done with a 427 or 502 witch redlines at about 6500rpm and idles a hair above 600rpm. But the cylinders on those motors displace about 1L per chamber.

Best done supra I have seen was a 650hp one that had about 700lb of tourque and blew the pants off a 1200hp one with 850lb of tourque since its tourque line was flatter. High hp numbers are nothing when you cant push them. Also considering your in europe you should benefit even more from a flatter tourque line since slowing down at every corner and acelerating back up would be quicker ( I call it turbo diesel sundrome). Also keep in mind that a supra is not a completly lightweight car. Its weighs in acess of 3000lb if im not mistaken.

[Knipex]

Talking about more sedate power figures here but way back when i was looking at buying my Westfield I visited one of the club meetings at a race track to get the opertunity to drive a couple or examples with different engines.

I spotted one in particular that sounded very cheap and was powered by a turbo charged RS engine.

I asked for a spin and the owner let me take it down the main straight. I was amazed and decided there and then to buy but so as not to appear to anxious to the seller I just thanked him and walked away (planning on returning later).

Luckily I got talking to another owner and he advised to to take a drive for a full lap before making the decision and warned me to be very carefull on turn 3 (slow in but it loosened up about half way round so you could really floor it.)

I returned to the owner and he reluctantly agreed to let me drive a full lap. All was going well, I dropped to second braking hard entering turn 3 and about half way through floored it and WHAM turbo kicks in and the back goes out. Lucky or me I hit the gravel trap.

The car was an accident waiting to happen. You had to be so carefull on bends cause if the turbo kicked in all that extra power just cracked the back wheels and you just hung on for the ride.....

The turbo on my TDI on the other hand is a dream. All that low down torque means that I dont miss the turbo at lower reves and you dont even feel it kick in (unless you really really look for it.)

[fillip]

It's a big concern with the guys on the Supra forums because a stock Supra can be pretty tail happy as it is, let alone with a big turbo that can kick in as you're accelerating out of a turn. The stock traction control of Supras is poo aswell so most guys upgrade that to cope better, but the forums are still littered with plenty of tails of people spinning 360 as they leave a motorway slip road or round-a-bout because the power suddenly kicks in and sends the rear end sideways... sounds like fun http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/naughty.gif

[Pug]

On Kev's point - RWD Turbos, such as the Westie & fill's Supras would suffer more in my mind than a FWD one, such as I'm guessing Kev's TDi is.
I remember going out in one of the first RS Turbos to roll of the Ford line when we did an incentive day for them at the Shooting School I worked for and one of the coaches cemented a 'deal' on one.
Lotsa torque steer but much easier to recover from than a back end fishtail. :D

[fillip]

On Kev's point - RWD Turbos, such as the Westie & fill's Supras would suffer more in my mind than a FWD one, such as I'm guessing Kev's TDi is.

With Supra's that is most definately the crux of the problem. As soon as the power kicks in on the rear wheels it just throws the car sideways, whereas if it was FWD I don't think it would be anywhere near as bad.

[jaguarking11]

What I was trying to say is that if the motor is properly tuned and set up the turbo dosent just kick in, it is seamless. Thats why a turboed motor should have enough low end tourque and a trubo that spins no matter what rpm, (geometric turbos).

Power suddenlty kicking in is a very bad thing even on a strait line as it can cause the rear to lock and sudenly you got a car that steeres itself on every bump.

[fillip]

What I was trying to say is that if the motor is properly tuned and set up the turbo dosent just kick in, it is seamless. Thats why a turboed motor should have enough low end tourque and a trubo that spins no matter what rpm, (geometric turbos).

Power suddenlty kicking in is a very bad thing even on a strait line as it can cause the rear to lock and sudenly you got a car that steeres itself on every bump.

I think I'll be after your advice in a few years then, it's a long time but unless I win the lottery I won't be having my dream car just yet (read one of my dream cars.). http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/wink.gif

[walkitiki]

I think I'll be after your advice in a few years then, it's a long time but unless I win the lottery I won't be having my dream car just yet (read one of my dream cars.). http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/wink.gif

I'll make you a deal, if either of us wins, we'll split the earnings so that two of us will get our dream cars! :thumb:

[fillip]

I'll make you a deal, if either of us wins, we'll split the earnings so that two of us will get our dream cars! :thumb:

Sounds good, though the current exchange rates work in your favour http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/tongue.gif http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/grin.gif

*virtual shake*

What is your dream car btw?

Mine just made the new Gillette advert (http://images.seducemail.com/vault/calgarysupra/gillettem3powernitro.mov)
They need to lose the ricer neons though http://wizdforums.co.uk/images/smilies/dry.gif

[walkitiki]

Here you go:

Probably one of several Porsche's I'd buy if I had the money, but this is probably my favorite. Any of the 3.0 or 3.3 Turbos from the 1970s to the 80s. Here's a link, they're essentially all the same from 1978 through 1989, but the page for 1986 had the best picture in my opinion..

1986 911 (930) Turbo 3.3 (http://content2.eu.porsche.com/prod/pag/classic.nsf/usaenglish/porschecars_911_Turbo_1986_story?OpenDocument&popup)

Or.. I could always go with a Carrera and sell it to Bill ^_^

(link for carrera: 1973 Carrera RS (http://content3.eu.porsche.com/prod/pag/classic.nsf/usaenglish/porschecars_911_Carrera_RS_1973_story?OpenDocument&popup) )

@mnpctech: which is better, duck or whale?

[Duffman]

Good writeup on Turbos VS Superchargers...

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/may05/nerds/

and the followup.

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/june05/nerds/

[jaguarking11]

Well I have many favorite cars and If I won the lottery I would go brocke quick.
I would own, every vette model begining with the C1,C2,C3,C4,C5,C6. I would own a 50aniversery C5, a gransport C4, sledgehamer C4, a lingenfelter C5 (0-60 in 1.9sec yummmmy) A new C6 lingenfelter.

And thats just my vette list.

My mustang list is as folows.
65stang
69stang
68gt500 (shelby goodness)
71boss
93boss 10L
95 last 5.0
05GT

Now on to other cars. a 63grandsport corvette (extremly rare and expensive, but oh so delicious)
Id like a real shebly cobra as well

Now on to my euro cars.
Jaguar d-type v12 (I melt at the sight of this one)
1980's XJS with the v12 ofcourse
VW Corrado form the 90's with the v6
aston martin db7
aston martin vanquish

Now other cars that I love.
Ford GT40 from the 60's, new ford GT. Buick Grand National, Chevy Bell Air
and now to complete the list for the time being SALEEN S7 twin turbo
http://www.saleen.com/saleen_s7_main.htm

Thats my list for now, I have more but I fear the thread will be way too long.

[jaguarking11]

Good writeup on Turbos VS Superchargers...

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/may05/nerds/

and the followup.

http://www.nissanperformancemag.com/june05/nerds/

i skimed through the articles quickly. And I disagree with the title as well. Turbos are not superior to superchargers and superchargers are not superior to turbos. Depending on the aplication either one can be very well done. A turbocharged car can put thousends of hp and so can supercharged motors. A supercharger is ineficient because it uses crank power by one standard but if you look at it the power is on demand on a supercharger. Step on the pedal and instant power comes and lag is non existant. THe engine acts as a huge unit. Turbos use wasted gases but in practice they will not deliver power like a supercharger can. Iamgine going a twisty track and deceling and aceling at every corner. The car thats supercharged will go around the corners and deliver constant controlable power weare as the turbod car can deliver a jerky powerband like in knips case.

Now dont get me wrong, I prefer turbod engines over supercharged engines but im mearly pointing out the falcity of pure numbers.


An engine should deliver a tourque line thats as flat as possible and hp rates should be kept as high as posible though the rpm line. That explains why you could see a 650hp turboed engined car beat the living crap out of an engine delivering twice the hp, being that the second car is turbocharged and not supercharged. At some point turbos give loads of hp at the expense of a tourque line that looks like a earthquake graph insted of a smooth powerband.

[Archimedes]

I don't want an expensive car, myself. But ever since the first time I saw these cars on US shores a few years back, I've lusted for them.

http://www.subaru.com/shop/overview.jsp?model=IMPREZA&trim=WRX_STI_SEDAN&command=overview

:D

[jaguarking11]

I don't want an expensive car, myself. But ever since the first time I saw these cars on US shores a few years back, I've lusted for them.

http://www.subaru.com/shop/overview.jsp?model=IMPREZA&trim=WRX_STI_SEDAN&command=overview

:D

That looks suprisingly like a sabb. I think it shares allot with the sabb's. GM loves sharing platforms so you get allot of cross cars. For example the chevy impala shares some stuff with opel. They criss cros brands and platforms allot. And depending on the way you look at it, it could be a good or bad thing.

On another note, I realy love the new gto. http://www.pontiac.com/gto/index.jsp?brand=home
400hp ls2 6.0L of pure power.

Or http://www.jaguarusa.com/us/en/vehicles/xj/overview/models.htm
Yes I love me jags. And the new xjR is just up my alley.